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Dads breaking generational abuse, how do you discipline your kids?
- Thread starter utay62
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- advice request dads
@utay62 Biggest thing is to remember that the dude is 2. He's not supposed to be able to concentrate or focus. He's supposed to be exploring and being silly.
If the class he is in doesn't recognize that and embrace it for what it is, then time to change to a different activity.
Also, if you're frustrated that your 2 year old can't focus, then the road ahead will be long and arduous for you. Some kids are task oriented from early ages, and some don't focus til much later like 5 or 6. Your job is just to support the kind of kid you got!
If the class he is in doesn't recognize that and embrace it for what it is, then time to change to a different activity.
Also, if you're frustrated that your 2 year old can't focus, then the road ahead will be long and arduous for you. Some kids are task oriented from early ages, and some don't focus til much later like 5 or 6. Your job is just to support the kind of kid you got!
@utay62 Diverting the behavior. Engaging. Deep breathing. Distractions. These all work well. My wife and I (her more than me) received punitive punishments as children and it does nothing except drive a wedge between you and your kids. We were both physically abused by our parents as punishment (not often but one spanking or slap counts in my book as abuse) so we’re working hard to break the generational cycle of punishment and abuse.
Realistically, what’s punishing a toddler going to actually do? As kids get older we are going to work with them on how to make up for behavior. We firmly believe in restorative justice and it’s easy to translate that to the home.
Realistically, what’s punishing a toddler going to actually do? As kids get older we are going to work with them on how to make up for behavior. We firmly believe in restorative justice and it’s easy to translate that to the home.
@utay62 Book Recommendation: No Drama Discipline It's co-written by a medical doctor and a child psychotherapist. It's really illuminating and practical.
We try to follow it in our home, though I confess to failing. But it's okay to fail, so long as you apologize to your child and explain that you made a mistake (which is discussed in the book).
Here's a sheet from the book that we stick on our fridge.
Here's a handout from the authors intended to hand to teachers or childcare providers.
We try to follow it in our home, though I confess to failing. But it's okay to fail, so long as you apologize to your child and explain that you made a mistake (which is discussed in the book).
Here's a sheet from the book that we stick on our fridge.
Here's a handout from the authors intended to hand to teachers or childcare providers.
isaiah9six
New member
@utay62 Many, MANY 2 year olds just don't have the developmental capacity to participate in organized classes like gymnastics. Its just not developmentally appropriate. I get that some 2 yo's can do it, but most can't.
You did the right thing to acknowledge that you were triggered by your child's completely normal and developmentally appropriate behavior and just opt to head out early.
My advice here is twofold: 1) do some reflecting and decide if your child's behavior was inappropriate for the class or if YOU were just triggered by it. For all I know, your kid's behavior was in-line with general expectations for the class and he wasn't hurting anyone/anything and it was simply your expectations that need to be adjusted. If this is the case, then you have to decide - are you willing/capable of adjusting your expectations and embracing your child's behavior? Your kid doesn't NEED a gymnastics class at age 2. There are plenty of other options. So its totally fine if you can't handle this type of class right now. Its entirely reasonable to opt out of formal extracurriculars, especially in the toddler years, because the "benefits" to your child aren't worth the very real toll it takes on the parents.
2) if this class just is not a good fit for your kid, again, totally acceptable to just not do this type of class. There are usually open gym style gymnastics opportunities for toddlers where they just get to really let loose and explore. In my opinion, this is actually how all toddler gymnastics "classes" should be but yeah. My kid is 2.5 and the only structured class she does is swim lessons and I only do those because its the best option available to us and I think its important she has water/swim exposure for safety purposes.
Now, that said, it doesn't mean there aren't skills you can start working on now to help your child regulate/learn appropriate behavior, especially in public. Again though, this is AFTER adjusting your own expectations as a parent. Regulate yourself FIRST, then help your kid. One thing that can be helpful is talking about expectations during class before you get there. A lot of toddler parenting "experts" will call this "prep" or something similar. Prep the shit out of your kid. Talk about what they can expect, how they might feel, what YOU expect from them, etc. Also, role play! Practice gymnastics class at home! Sometimes you're the teacher and they are the student, and sometimes they are the teacher and you are the student. You should model both the behavior you want to see, and also model incorrect behavior (so that your child can identify it and "help" you correct it). Another thing to do in the moment is to pull your child away from the group, potentially out of the room, to take time to calm down and "reset." This isn't a time for you to scold or yell or shame them - its an opportunity to help them REGULATE (really, co-regulate because developmentally toddlers and children really only have the capacity to co-regulate).
Lastly, since you specifically mentioned you're looking for more tools for your arsenal, I strongly suggest the books "no bad kids" and "the whole brain child" as well as listening to the podcast "good inside" by Dr. Becky Kennedy (she also has a book I just haven't read it yet) and then the class by Big Little Feelings (find them on IG).
You did the right thing to acknowledge that you were triggered by your child's completely normal and developmentally appropriate behavior and just opt to head out early.
My advice here is twofold: 1) do some reflecting and decide if your child's behavior was inappropriate for the class or if YOU were just triggered by it. For all I know, your kid's behavior was in-line with general expectations for the class and he wasn't hurting anyone/anything and it was simply your expectations that need to be adjusted. If this is the case, then you have to decide - are you willing/capable of adjusting your expectations and embracing your child's behavior? Your kid doesn't NEED a gymnastics class at age 2. There are plenty of other options. So its totally fine if you can't handle this type of class right now. Its entirely reasonable to opt out of formal extracurriculars, especially in the toddler years, because the "benefits" to your child aren't worth the very real toll it takes on the parents.
2) if this class just is not a good fit for your kid, again, totally acceptable to just not do this type of class. There are usually open gym style gymnastics opportunities for toddlers where they just get to really let loose and explore. In my opinion, this is actually how all toddler gymnastics "classes" should be but yeah. My kid is 2.5 and the only structured class she does is swim lessons and I only do those because its the best option available to us and I think its important she has water/swim exposure for safety purposes.
Now, that said, it doesn't mean there aren't skills you can start working on now to help your child regulate/learn appropriate behavior, especially in public. Again though, this is AFTER adjusting your own expectations as a parent. Regulate yourself FIRST, then help your kid. One thing that can be helpful is talking about expectations during class before you get there. A lot of toddler parenting "experts" will call this "prep" or something similar. Prep the shit out of your kid. Talk about what they can expect, how they might feel, what YOU expect from them, etc. Also, role play! Practice gymnastics class at home! Sometimes you're the teacher and they are the student, and sometimes they are the teacher and you are the student. You should model both the behavior you want to see, and also model incorrect behavior (so that your child can identify it and "help" you correct it). Another thing to do in the moment is to pull your child away from the group, potentially out of the room, to take time to calm down and "reset." This isn't a time for you to scold or yell or shame them - its an opportunity to help them REGULATE (really, co-regulate because developmentally toddlers and children really only have the capacity to co-regulate).
Lastly, since you specifically mentioned you're looking for more tools for your arsenal, I strongly suggest the books "no bad kids" and "the whole brain child" as well as listening to the podcast "good inside" by Dr. Becky Kennedy (she also has a book I just haven't read it yet) and then the class by Big Little Feelings (find them on IG).
maverickalo
New member
@utay62 Thanks for sharing. There are 2 emotions, love and fear. Kids not doing what they are supposed to do makes you angry, but really it’s fear running the show. You think that if this kid is not under my control it looks bad on me as the parent, people will think less of you and your parenting skills, I’m fearful of that judgement. It makes you angry, and you direct it towards the kid, that is the style I grew up with too. Love the kid, use love instead of fear to direct the relationship, find a positive way to engage the kid and get them interested in what the class is doing, you may do this at home to practice, follow me doing stretches just like the instructor and peers. Use love as the motivator instead of fear, and when you get it figured out with that kid, it won’t translate to another kid they are all different! However love vs fear, love wins, fear alienates the kid, remember you felt that too! I’m glad you walked away without getting frustrated then angry, you are breaking the cycle because you are aware of it, good job, great dad!
@utay62 Just throwing in my own experience here, my son is almost 2 and he goes to a little kids gymnastics class and a music class with my parents occasionally. The instructors in both make it very known to everyone, there’s absolutely no pressure for the kids to participate. They try to make the activities as interesting and engaging as possible and ask that we as parents/caretakers participate in the activity to try to get the kids involved, but it’s a safe place for the kids to explore so if they just want to climb around on the mats the whole time then that’s perfectly fine. And yes my son, explores, meanwhile I’m participating like crazy trying to make it seem fun to him so I’m usually swamped with other parents kids as they just browse their phones.
lovedaaboo
New member
@utay62 Dad of a toddler with my own anger issues. Have seen some good advice here. I use timers and “one more” to varying degrees of success.
My two cents is to remember that at his age, running off and doing his own thing is age-appropriate. Our gymnastics class nearly expects chaos. I observe other parents putting a lot of pressure on themselves and their kids for obedience, but nobody really cares about anyone else’s kids. Maybe gymnastics isn’t a great activity, if it’s a trigger, or maybe you can embrace the chaos a little and focus on the joy your kid is finding from running off? I’ve had to steer into the skid a little and just make sure my LO enjoys his class.
My two cents is to remember that at his age, running off and doing his own thing is age-appropriate. Our gymnastics class nearly expects chaos. I observe other parents putting a lot of pressure on themselves and their kids for obedience, but nobody really cares about anyone else’s kids. Maybe gymnastics isn’t a great activity, if it’s a trigger, or maybe you can embrace the chaos a little and focus on the joy your kid is finding from running off? I’ve had to steer into the skid a little and just make sure my LO enjoys his class.
@utay62 I'm trying to break the cycle as well!
For me, two things:
1 - I tell my kids all the time "I'm trying to do better than what I got. That doesn't mean I get it right all the time, but I am trying." I think the honesty helps - on both sides. It shows them that I love them and care for them and allows for some grace and forgiveness in hard situations. I also think it helps me think back on when I was a kid and how I was treated in similar situations; I don't want that for my kids.
2 - Counseling for myself. It was only recently that I finally realized that the issues I have from my childhood are serious enough and deep enough that I need some help. I see 3 different phases (so far) in my childhood hurt - first, "this is normal" which lasted all the way in to my 20s. Then I met my wife and saw how horribly her ex-husband treated her and the kids, which brought me to phase 2, "yeah, I was mentally abused as a kid, but not like THAT. I can handle it." Finally, phase 3 (current phase) came about when my then 4yo daughter, during dinner-time prayers, asked God to "help daddy not be angry all the time." Man, what a bricks! Shortly after that, I got myself in to see a counselor. It's a long road to recovery - I've only been seeing my guy for about 8 months, and we're only just now starting to really dig deep in to the past.
Anyway, Dad, you're doing great. You're not a bad dad. The fact that this is so forefront in your mind and heart is proof that you're doing better than what you got as a kid. Hang in there, brother. We're all pullin for ya.
For me, two things:
1 - I tell my kids all the time "I'm trying to do better than what I got. That doesn't mean I get it right all the time, but I am trying." I think the honesty helps - on both sides. It shows them that I love them and care for them and allows for some grace and forgiveness in hard situations. I also think it helps me think back on when I was a kid and how I was treated in similar situations; I don't want that for my kids.
2 - Counseling for myself. It was only recently that I finally realized that the issues I have from my childhood are serious enough and deep enough that I need some help. I see 3 different phases (so far) in my childhood hurt - first, "this is normal" which lasted all the way in to my 20s. Then I met my wife and saw how horribly her ex-husband treated her and the kids, which brought me to phase 2, "yeah, I was mentally abused as a kid, but not like THAT. I can handle it." Finally, phase 3 (current phase) came about when my then 4yo daughter, during dinner-time prayers, asked God to "help daddy not be angry all the time." Man, what a bricks! Shortly after that, I got myself in to see a counselor. It's a long road to recovery - I've only been seeing my guy for about 8 months, and we're only just now starting to really dig deep in to the past.
Anyway, Dad, you're doing great. You're not a bad dad. The fact that this is so forefront in your mind and heart is proof that you're doing better than what you got as a kid. Hang in there, brother. We're all pullin for ya.
@utay62 At 2-4, timeouts worked the best for me. Remove them from the situation and have them have a little “time out”. And for a 2 year old, the timeout could be like 2 minutes at most. It’s usually enough to “switch” their brain away from whatever undesirable activity they were doing and reset.
Edit: talk to them too. The timeout doesn’t do much if they just sit there alone and don’t understand why they are taking a break. Talk to them while they have their timeout and explain why they are there and what they can do instead next time.
Edit: talk to them too. The timeout doesn’t do much if they just sit there alone and don’t understand why they are taking a break. Talk to them while they have their timeout and explain why they are there and what they can do instead next time.
janggeungulk
New member
@wscantlin In terms of ‘breaking the cycle’. Timeouts have the added benefit of taking you away from the situation and avoid reacting out of anger or instinct.
seekinanswrs
New member
@wscantlin How does or did your kid react to time out?
My son goes absolutely bananas when I try time out. He gets very defiant and sometimes outright aggressive. He will immediately try to escape from the time out and if I won't let him then he will start hitting and or kicking me.
My son goes absolutely bananas when I try time out. He gets very defiant and sometimes outright aggressive. He will immediately try to escape from the time out and if I won't let him then he will start hitting and or kicking me.
@wscantlin Was about to say isolated timeout is actually counterproductive for them learning.
everybodyvote
New member
@utay62 There is lots of great advice in here. My addition, If you have the capacity to develop a “serious voice”
That your kid understands means you are going to pick him up or change the situation, this can help. We don’t have any discipline we enforce on our 2 year old but if he is about to hurt himself or someone else, or we really need him to do something like eat before bed, I can change my tone from happy, playful to serious, firm. He knows it and tends to pause what he’s doing. I usually hug him and whisper to him why I needed him to stop/change. Not sure how much he understands but I still ask him, “do you understand why I need you to stop doing X?” And he has been remarkable at getting the gist.
I’ll also just say that I agree that if the gym situation seems to be one where he has to be super orderly and doesn’t want to be, it may just not be a good fit, and that’s OK, he’s only two.
That your kid understands means you are going to pick him up or change the situation, this can help. We don’t have any discipline we enforce on our 2 year old but if he is about to hurt himself or someone else, or we really need him to do something like eat before bed, I can change my tone from happy, playful to serious, firm. He knows it and tends to pause what he’s doing. I usually hug him and whisper to him why I needed him to stop/change. Not sure how much he understands but I still ask him, “do you understand why I need you to stop doing X?” And he has been remarkable at getting the gist.
I’ll also just say that I agree that if the gym situation seems to be one where he has to be super orderly and doesn’t want to be, it may just not be a good fit, and that’s OK, he’s only two.
runninggator
New member
@utay62 Just my 2c as I took my highly energetic and somewhat difficult daughter to gymnastics starting at the same age, and she was just impossible. What an ordeal omg.
Other kids would listen and try to follow directions but not mine, she just wanted to do her own thing and then also act up if asked to do the warm ups etc. The teachers don't sweat it, the other parents didn't care, and I did feel a tad embarrassed but at the end of the day she's a very young kid, people get it. I pushed through remaining calm and good natured and encouraging to my kid. it's just how 2yr olds are, there's no point in trying to get them to follow instructions when they're just too amped and excited about playing.
Gymnastics at this age is simply designed for gaining confidence and just to teach them how to follow instructions. It takes time to learn. Expectations are low!
BUT guess what, we're still going to gymnastics a couple of years on, and she's fantastic at it. The structure is easy to follow and no one worries if the kids don't get it right, it's about trying new things. She's gradually learning to follow instructions and it's her absolute favourite activity.
When you feel frustrated about their behaviour, you've got to take a step back and ask yourself "does this really matter?" and "are they even old enough to behave better". In my case the answer is often no, I'm just putting unreasonable expectations on a very young kid.
I think as parents we can feel anxious about our kids imperfect behaviour but we forget that they are being normal for their age,still developing their self regulation skills, and the issue probably not even important in most cases.
So they didn't listen at gymnastics today, annoying? Yes. Important, not at all. Literally nothing bad has happened because of it, so don't sweat it.
Other kids would listen and try to follow directions but not mine, she just wanted to do her own thing and then also act up if asked to do the warm ups etc. The teachers don't sweat it, the other parents didn't care, and I did feel a tad embarrassed but at the end of the day she's a very young kid, people get it. I pushed through remaining calm and good natured and encouraging to my kid. it's just how 2yr olds are, there's no point in trying to get them to follow instructions when they're just too amped and excited about playing.
Gymnastics at this age is simply designed for gaining confidence and just to teach them how to follow instructions. It takes time to learn. Expectations are low!
BUT guess what, we're still going to gymnastics a couple of years on, and she's fantastic at it. The structure is easy to follow and no one worries if the kids don't get it right, it's about trying new things. She's gradually learning to follow instructions and it's her absolute favourite activity.
When you feel frustrated about their behaviour, you've got to take a step back and ask yourself "does this really matter?" and "are they even old enough to behave better". In my case the answer is often no, I'm just putting unreasonable expectations on a very young kid.
I think as parents we can feel anxious about our kids imperfect behaviour but we forget that they are being normal for their age,still developing their self regulation skills, and the issue probably not even important in most cases.
So they didn't listen at gymnastics today, annoying? Yes. Important, not at all. Literally nothing bad has happened because of it, so don't sweat it.
joy2give2u
New member
@utay62 Having grown up raised by a single parent (mostly) that was abused themselves growing up, I took lessons from that parent as what NOT to do. I have a lot of the same anger issues, so I went to counseling and learned different ways of conflict resolution and better ways of handling frustration without hands.
I also keep a sharp eye on alcohol use because I come from a long line of alcoholics.
All you can do is recognize the patterns and understand you will make mistakes, but just keep working on yourself and don't linger on bad decisions. Learn from them. I made a lot of mistakes with my oldest while I figured it out. There is nothing abusive, but things I should have done better.
I also keep a sharp eye on alcohol use because I come from a long line of alcoholics.
All you can do is recognize the patterns and understand you will make mistakes, but just keep working on yourself and don't linger on bad decisions. Learn from them. I made a lot of mistakes with my oldest while I figured it out. There is nothing abusive, but things I should have done better.
dreamseeker
New member
@utay62 I wouldn’t feel ashamed. Leaving early is one of the discipline techniques in your arsenal. It’s hard when they’re not fully speaking but when my daughter is acting like that I do exactly what you did.
I try a few times to calm her down by kneeling to her level and telling her as calm as I can that she doesn’t need to be upset but she needs to calm down if she wants to stay. If the behavior gets worse I just tell her I’m sorry but we need to go home and that’s that.
Your son learned that you’ll follow through with what you say and have successfully set a boundary for him that he’ll eventually come to understand properly.
It sounds to me like you’re doing a great job.
I try a few times to calm her down by kneeling to her level and telling her as calm as I can that she doesn’t need to be upset but she needs to calm down if she wants to stay. If the behavior gets worse I just tell her I’m sorry but we need to go home and that’s that.
Your son learned that you’ll follow through with what you say and have successfully set a boundary for him that he’ll eventually come to understand properly.
It sounds to me like you’re doing a great job.
blameless35
New member
@utay62 2 year olds don't listen. It sounds like you're being too rigid with this. No one expects total concentration from a 2 year old at any class. The fact that you're getting heated over this shows you may need to evaluate your own internal anger. It's going to get much more difficult than this. I'm not being judgy but this would never make me angry. I see it quite the opposite. Kids will be kids.
@utay62 I’m late to this party, and you’ve already gotten great advice, but let me just say: you broke the cycle. Don’t you fucking hang your head in shame! You’re a fucking dad! The hardest things to change are the things worn into us like the groove of a record. There’s a reason it’s called being in a rut. But you’re out of that rut. Even at the most difficult, you’ve chosen to forge a new path.
You’re a goddamn warrior, dad. You are striving into the unknown all for your son. What you’re doing doesn’t change your past at all but it changes him, it shows him the kind of man he should be. That’s bigger than any gift you can ever give him.
I’m proud of you. He’s proud of you. He doesn’t get it yet. He might never get it. But it matters. And it’s your doing.
You’re a goddamn warrior, dad. You are striving into the unknown all for your son. What you’re doing doesn’t change your past at all but it changes him, it shows him the kind of man he should be. That’s bigger than any gift you can ever give him.
I’m proud of you. He’s proud of you. He doesn’t get it yet. He might never get it. But it matters. And it’s your doing.
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