I have full custody of my kids (4, 6 & 8) indefinitely and I don’t know how to tell them why

@hisman If she was proved sober through the hair test, why don't you let it go? Is it that you think that was inaccurate and her refusal means she had been drinking in reality? Or some need to apply 'the rules' based on refusing the test?

Ultimately how do you best get confidence she is sober, and if she is - what is best for the kids?
 
@asbo That’s definitely the question here. Her behavior has mirrored the behavior she had when she was drinking. It’s been concerning. The hair test is a relief but her actions two years ago cause me to lose all trust. She blew a .26 with the kids in the car (wasn’t the first time) and continually lied about her use. That’s why the court ordered breathalyzer request was put in. I can do it three times a year and I haven’t used the provision at all until two weeks ago. For her to not do it, well, it’s a big deal. It’s written out clearly that her parenting time is suspended if she refuses. I believe it would’ve been neglectful of me to NOT adhere to the ruling.
 
@hisman What's concerning here is that someone who has been and is currently in recovery should understand the gravity of the situation.

While a small part of me could understand having made a one time mistake and having an ex constantly making me prove myself, THIS ISN'T EVEN THAT.

She has a pattern of behavior. One expect humility and contrition from someone who is truly in recovery - even if she had a temporary lapse.

Plus, it sounds like the court only allowing three tests in a time frame was protecting her from being subjected to a power move by a vindictive ex. And you haven't even exercised that stipulation.

I don't know about you, but I would do just about anything to prove myself to the court, my ex, my children if I had ever made such a serious mistake. Hell, I'd do it even if I hadn't even made a mistake just to be able to see my kids.

I don't think you are being petty or vindictive. I think you, as a parent, absolutely have to do this to ensure that your children are safe. Even emotionally safe from someone battling the demon of addiction. But this is literal physical safety. You would never forgive yourself for being "cool" and this time someone gets hurt or killed.

Tell them that mommy is sick and made a bad decision to break the rules and that a judge has made a decision to give mommy some time to make sure that she is well and safe.

Al Anon is a wonderful resource. I hope you strongly consider checking them out. And children's therapists are amazing people who can help your kids and help you navigate these this situation in how to help them understand and cope with everything going on.
 
@asbo If the courts say someone cannot refuse a test without consequences they decide upon, no party can decide what happens regardless of the results besides the court who made the decision to impose consequences for refusing said test.

In essence. This has nothing to do with the father besides he wanted to have her take a test because he thought it was the right thing to do. Everything after that was completely out of his control.
 
@asbo Others have given you good answers to this question but I’d also like to point out that a hair follicle test shows long term use. It doesn’t prove anything as far as if she was drinking or not a few days ago.
 
@hisman Even if you have full custody, can't she visit your house? I know it might be hard or a touchy subject, but that way your kids would still be able to see their mother?
 
@hisman I don't know how you explain this because I don't understand it myself. She's sober and no other mention of parenting issues. She probably promised she'd see them because she didn't think this infraction would lead to removal of custody, and I can see why. She didn't play by the rules but she's still sober and seeing the kids, isn't that the most important thing?
 
@oneofthesheep If she’s sober, I want her to go back to having parenting time. Absolutely. The kids need her. It’s tricky not having a ruling and no clear end to this. The kids are asking questions and are obviously wondering if what happened two years ago is happening again.
 
@oneofthesheep FYI there’s no guarantee she’s sober. Hair follicle tests show long term use only. She could have been smashed when he asked her to test (which would certainly explain why she refused) and it wouldn’t show up on a hair follicle test unless she was drinking for a weeks or longer.
 
@hisman Why not take the kids to visit with her while you remain with them? Just stand by and let them visit for a couple of hours, then take them home. Honestly, the notion that the government has jurisdiction over family decisions like this is concerning. You make the decision that you think is best.
 
@midamericatruth The only way to tell if she’s hiding substance abuse is to use this provision. I hadn’t done this test in two years. Her behavior mirrored her drinking behavior so I had no choice. To not do it would be neglectful, especially with how often she endangered the kids in the past.
 
@midamericatruth Respect for raising a reasonable point that you knew would be unlikely to be well received. Responding to you with equal respect.

The fact say she is a substance abuser: there’s the DUI that started all this. The breathalyzer is there because she showed the court that she does not have the personal accountability to maintain sobriety. Think of how tilted courts generally are in the mother’s favor and think what level of offense and subsequent behavior it would take for her custody to be taken outright.

I think it’s really difficult that the dad has the ability (responsibility really) to trigger the breathalyzer - but that’s what the court set up when she drove drunk and got caught.

Mom’s situation is definitely unfortunate but what I’m seeing is that her irresponsibility here is causing a hard time for dad (who has to make explanations about why mom isn’t here) and kids (who have to hear and understand said explanations then process them). My guess is that this is not the first time mom and drinking and irresponsibility have made for problems for the rest of the fam.

I dig the empathy in your comment, 100%, but having been a kid with a drunk parent I can say that it’s unlikely to be helpful to go the poor mom route; nothing will change until there are consequences and she has to learn to be accountable.
 
@midamericatruth The bigger picture is that the mother has been a substance abuser and that substance abuse led to child abuse. The best interest of the kids is for him to verify that she is still not abusing when her behavior changed to mirror when she was abusing.

That's the bigger picture.
 
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