Is the preschooler age supposed to br this exhausting/what am I doing wrong?

[laurie4321]

Update: did my son read this post? My son went to sleep on his own during nap the day after I wrote this post. No fight at all. He laid down in his bed and cuddled his animals and fell asleep. The night at bedtime was a little bit harder but he really did well with trying to stay in is room at night. No fights at meal time either. The next day, he played quietly in his room for an hour and a half! He came out a couple of times but no tears, no fights! That night at bedtime, I did the check in method. Put him down to sleep a little later told him I’d be back to check on him after I did my bedtime routine. I came back 10 min later and he was still awake. So I kissed him and told him I’d be back after I brushed my teeth. Also got a sticker chart for staying in room that he’s pretty excited about. I waited a bit longer and saw on the monitor he already fell asleep. These are breakthrough moments! I’m so proud of him!

My 3.5 year old goes to preschool during the week, so only the evenings are hard. Getting him to eat dinner is a struggle unless it’s something he likes, getting ready for bed is good but then he takes 2 hours to go to sleep. Once lights are out he gets a burst of energy and he won’t go to sleep. I try to lay with him as long as possible and rub his back but he just won’t fall asleep. That’s after run around time, bath, magnesium lotion, bedtime snack, books, potty, and story. I end up giving up and have him come downstairs while I clean up the kitchen but then he gets into things. He will run laps around the house and then we go upstairs and he will then fall asleep. You might be thinking “I know that so easy just don’t have him nap!” Well it seems to not make a difference on days he does or doesn’t nap. So he will end up falling asleep by 9:30pm. I’m exhausted and want to go to sleep so that leaves maybe 10’min for husband and I.

Weekends are even harder. There is no time for either of us. Preschooler will not nap unless we take him for a drive. I feel like we shouldn’t have to do that, right? But if he doesn’t nap, he loses his mind by dinner time and we cannot handle his behavior. He will fight every single thing from dinner to the pajamas he picks out. He’s practically hyperventilating by the time it’s bedtime but will only stay asleep for 30 minutes because it’s so early for him to go to bed. Then he’s back to energy!!! My husband and I have NO time for just ourselves. Oh hire a babysitter? We could but shouldn’t this whole thing just be easier? Shouldn’t we have nighttime to hang out and watch some shows together? He doesn’t have any of these behavior issues at school and will nap with no problem. He does play independently so that’s when I clean up the house. This just doesn’t seem right . Thanks for reading.

 

[epicpaymentsny]

@laurie4321 Yea they say “terrible twos” but actually between ages 3 and 4 is an even more tough time. Some call it the “threenager” stage. A lot of what you said is normal. This video gave me reassurance when I was struggling with my daughter.

 

[crossroad77]

@laurie4321 I would readjust expectations for bedtime if he still needs a nap. My 20mo schedule is
6:30 wake up 1-2:30pm nap and 9-9:30 bedtime. I literally cannot make him go to bed earlier or else he’ll just be bustling around for an hour or wake up in the middle of the night due to lack of sleep pressure. Can you shorten your son’s nap? Cap to a Power Nap of 20 min? Should refresh him enough to carry him through the evening and make bedtime earlier. If not it might be time to drop the nap. And he will get used to it btw he won’t be cranky like that forever

 

[sabrina_]

@laurie4321 Did I write this post?

But seriously, our little 3 year old is verrrrry similar in terms of sleep and strong opinions, which I both love (love a girl with strong opinions!) and find a lot to navigate.

And we also have a 5 month old, so my partner and I don’t really have time for each other. We’ll go for drives to get the kids to nap and get a coffee and talk, so I suppose that’s our time together. We are reaching an age where we may be comfortable leaving the kids to go out for lunch or dinner, maybe, and we are ok with it. It’s a season and things will change. This isn’t forever!

I see you on the sleep thing though. She will scream and fight it tooth and nail and can become so disregulated. We coslept for a long time and she still desperately wants to cosleep but I can’t for safety with the baby. So partner lies to sleep with her which often takes until 9:40. Contrary to another poster suggesting leaving him alone for quiet time, we have tried leaving her and it is like we are doing cry it out. She doesn’t run bedtime or the house - we have boundaries and routines in place - and once she’s in bed, she’s in bed. But she’s someone who loves physical touch and proximity and we get that and honour it.

Things that help us:
LOTS of physical play. Does he push or pull heavy things? Get lots of outdoor time? Ability to move his body in risky play? A lot of these behaviors (running around during dinner time, etc) strike me as a kid who needs more movement than other kids. May be cool to look up occupational therapist suggestions on regulating and calming exercises in preparation for calm time! Inside our girl is like a caged ferret. But outside she does independent play or helps dad with heavy hard work (lugging around branches, sweeping or raking). So good.

I involve her in household tasks even though it slows me down and can make a mess. She loves doing dishes. She loves helping make dinner or bake snacks. She loves helping with diaper time. Having a kid feel like a responsible member of the household with meaningful contributions is huge for behaviour and their self perception.

I also started listening to the audiobook Good Inside by Dr. Becky and am already finding it incredibly helpful. Maybe worth a listen? She talks boundaries, big feeling kids, sleep stuff. Very logical and empathic and firm.

 

[lizlugo51]

@sabrina_ Awesome suggestions. One thing to remember about quiet time tantrums is that with CIO, an infant thinks they are being abandoned + they struggle with object permanence and truly think they are alone, Toddlers are screaming not because they believe they are dying but because you are not complying to their desire. It’s ok for them to have big feelings, our job isn’t to avoid meltdowns, it’s to set boundaries while consistently showing up. “It’s ok to be angry because you don’t want to do quiet time, and I will check on you in 30 minutes.” They understand. They just wish they didn’t lol.

 

[laurie4321]

@lizlugo51 I am totally comfortable with him crying during quiet time but he will destroy his room if he’s stuck in there or will just make a game of it by running out and laughing as I take him back into his room. And I know he’s tired but of course I can’t force him to nap. It’s actually more work for me to do that. He will independently play just fine at other times like he talks to his animals and pretends play but that’s only if he doesn’t suspect we are doing quiet time.

 

[lizlugo51]

@laurie4321 Sorry I am responding to you in like 3 different places. We changed our daughter’s room (with the gate) into more of a safe space for her to get out energy and emotions, so it’s pretty sparse to avoid destruction. She cosleeps with us. We rotate toys and keep them in the living room, so now her room is only a few pieces of bolted furniture (like her floor bed and a chest for dress up), a closet with a lock, and a climbing gym/cocoon swing/pillows/some stuffed animals. She can bring a few books and toys in there, but mainly it’s a sensory space for when she is not regulated. Not everyone has the luxury of space to dedicate a whole room to be a very simple safe haven, but it’s worked well for us… despite my heartache dismantling the very beautiful nursery I designed.

 

[sabrina_]

@lizlugo51 I probably used incorrect wording - I understand it’s not cry it out, and I also know our kid in particular still requires support for regulating those feelings and that cannot effectively happen if left alone. I have a doubly neurotypical partner as well so we are extra sensitive to this stuff (as in, not making any assumptions or labeling our kid as such, but just being mindful that her brain could be wired a little differently with this stuff). I think for us right now the boundaries are having quiet time but knowing for the time being, this will require an adult presence. C’est la vie!

 

[lizlugo51]

@sabrina_ I totally understand and think it’s best to never leave distressed children. You are !

 

[laurie4321]

@sabrina_ I will check out that podcast!

 

[laurie4321]

Also what do you mean by risky play? Like climbing trees?

 

[sabrina_]

@laurie4321 Oh yes sorry! There are lots of variations of risky play - going fast, going up high, balancing, hiding - different forms of kids testing their bodies’ limits. It’s often done independently or with other kids - could be on playground equipment, riding a bike down a hill…things that may make you go ‘ehhhh I’m not sure….’ Without outright thinking ‘that’s really dangerous!’ There are lots of cool things on risky play - often, in nature - online!

 

[kyleeak]

@laurie4321 I’m sorry you are having a hard time. Please know I am not giving medical advice and my advice only applies to neurotypical, well children. Also know that I’m not judging or criticizing you.

You need to learn to set and keep consistent firm boundaries with your child and stop trying to control his body.

You cannot make your child eat and you cannot make him sleep. You have no control over these functions. He chooses to eat or not and his body decides when to sleep.

For meal times: you present the food, he decides whether or not to eat it. The food is only present for a limited amount of time then it goes away. If he doesn’t eat…the next meal will come soon enough.

For bedtime: do his routine. Lights off. Night night. He doesn’t have to be asleep for you to leave the room. He can absolutely adjust to laying quietly in his bed, even if he’s not asleep. If it helps him you can have a night light and tell him his choices are to look at books quietly in bed or go to sleep. But either way you are out of the room. Do not fight with him about things like dinner or pajamas. For example: give two options for pajamas. He has a minute to pick or you pick. Put the pajamas on him or he can do it himself but again he only has a brief amount of time to do that or you do it. Done.

Weekends: he needs more independent play. If you have “no time” on the weekends he’s not doing it enough, or what is taking your time?. You and daddy are not always available to play. If he doesn’t nap ok he still needs to have an hour or two of quiet time in bed. He does not have to sleep to lay quietly in bed and look at books or play quietly with toys.

You are letting your child be in charge of your household. It is not good for attachment or loving or kind to let a 3.5 year old be in charge of all of these decisions. It is very stressful for him and for you. You need to learn to be firm and consistent at all times while still remaining loving and caring as I’m sure you already are. Children thrive with predictability.

It will be hard at first but if you are extremely consistent he will adjust and both you and him will be much much happier

If you want a book on it that can go into detail I would do bringing up Bebe. You don’t need to do the whole book there is a section on this age range.

 

[laurie4321]

@kyleeak This is a good answer. For mealtimes, it’s less about him eating or not but more about him sitting in his chair instead of running all over the house or throwing his food or utensils. I’ve tried redirection for this, saying we don’t do that, taking him to a separate room and talking to him about it. How do I stop this behavior?

For naps and bedtimes, I’ll tuck him in and say good night but he just gets right up and leaves after me, so I lead him back in his room but he gets right up and out. He asks to cuddle so I do for a bit then I say okay I’m going now good night and leave but then he leaves right after me. He does not simply stay in his room for nap or bedtime. I tell him he doesn’t have to sleep but he can play or read books and he will do it for a few minutes then gets up. I spend all my time leading him back into his room that I just give up.

On weekends, I am constantly cleaning up messes that the kids leave or leading my preschooler back on his schedule. He always asks me to play with him which I do since I don’t have a lot of time with him during the week. I also have a baby. But even so, I should definitely have more time than I do.

He naps well and listens well at preschool which leads me to believe he’s neurotypical. I just think I’m doing something wrong. He does not respect me.

 

[lostandafraid]

@laurie4321 I only have a baby and I have zero time. I honestly think you need to adjust your expectations for this stage of life. Your child only sees you for a few hours in the evening so wants to spend as much time with you as he can. Can you put his bedtime back for another half hour or hour and involve him in the cleaning before his bedtime? He's staying up anyway so maybe just take the fight out of it. I don't think it's about respect, I think he just had an emotional need to be with you.

 

[floridabr]

@lostandafraid I second this. If he falls asleep at 9:30, that’s probably his natural bedtime. I would hate to make a battle of it. I get how exhausting it would be though.

 

[lizlugo51]

@laurie4321 Oh gosh you have a baby too. That adds more layers of complexity. If you don’t want to close his door, put a baby gate up in there and close it after you walk out. He may tantrum (which is NOT the same as infant CIO), but if the room is set up for him, he will eventually figure out that he has other options to occupy his time when he doesn’t get your attention. Our preschool basically told us that we and our house is our daughter’s “safe place”. This is a good thing in terms of attachment. She works so hard to be compliant and fit in socially during the day, that she needs to unload. She is so deregulated that she needs to act out. Her senses are overwhelmed so she needs extra/less input (either biting or saying everything is too loud!). Again, choose your battles. The comment above me is an excellent one!

 

[laurie4321]

@lizlugo51 He would jump right over a baby gate lol the only way for him to stay in his room would be to lock his door which I don’t want to do. That just feels wrong. I’ve stood at the door before while it was closed and he will throw his books all over the room because he’s so upset. He’s already broken a lamp from throwing it down.

 

[christbrah]

@laurie4321 If you can fully babyproof the room (no cords / lamps in reach etc) and put up an extra tall gate, you could at least feel better about him being safe when in his room alone.

 

[lizlugo51]

@laurie4321 My toddler broke her door off at the hinges, you are in good company luckily we have a very tall gate installed and sit on the other side of it while she rides the wave of her oftentimes violent tantrums. It’s fun .