I had to listen to my SiLs baby CIO over the holidays

[kristyrh]

And it absolutely solidified my reasoning and belief that a baby should never, ever, be left alone to cry in a dark, unfamiliar room for hours.

My nephew is about 20 months old. My SiL and her husband seem to be absolutely clueless on his cues with anything and would put him down to sleep when he wasn't even close to being tired.

Example: they let the baby have a nap for almost 4 hours, woke him at 4pm and then laid him down to sleep at 7:30pm. He wasn't tired at all. You could tell he was just as energetic as ever.They laid him in the pack n play and let him scream. Not just cry. I'm talking that poor baby screamed for almost 2 hours before he literally just probably shut down and went to sleep. They just let him. The entire house heard him. They did this almost every day for a week and kept insisting that they don't know why he wouldn't sleep.

They did this for naps too. And it just seemed to be getting to a point where the poor baby was just terrified of going to sleep so he'd scream and scream.

In their defense, I guess? They both work full time and their baby is in daycare 40+ hours a week, and has been since he was about 6 months old. On weekends they often hire a nanny or babysitter. No hate on daycare at all, I just feel like they, personally, have not really been super into trying to understand his needs.This vacation was the most time they've ever spent with him in a long time, so I can imagine they can be having problems with reading his cues.

I offered to help, and even other family members offered advice, stories, etc including myself but they refused and said he just needed to learn to "be more independent" because more often than not he ends up in their bed in the middle of the night and they hate it. Even my MiL was getting visibly upset and said something multiple times about how they need to do something other than letting him scream.

Anyway, it broke my heart and I'm 32 weeks pregnant so call it hormones or whatever but I had to sit outside at one point because the screaming was ripping me apart. It wasn't like a toddler tantrum scream, it was the "I'm scared, mom and dad!" Scream and the next morning he could barely talk his voice was so hoarse.

That's my holiday rant. I keep thinking about him now at home and wonder if they're still making him scream every night. I wish I could scoop him up and hug him.

 

[crocodilehuricane]

@kristyrh I’m a bit unclear what this group’s rules are on discussing other people’s parenting practices, but omg I need a place to debrief….

I’ve never actually had to listen to it, just hear about it, and it breaks my heart.

My SIL lets her 16 month old CIO all night when he’s teething. She says “I give him pain relief, I give him a dummy, I’ve given him everything, so I just close both doors”

What about giving the terrified kid who is all alone in pain a cuddle??

 

[deavallsbabe]

@crocodilehuricane when they say “baby has a full belly, clean diaper, safe shelter so let them CIO” it grinds my gears. it’s a special level of stupid to completely disregard that a baby (especially a human one) may have emotional needs.

 

[crocodilehuricane]

@deavallsbabe I know right! It’s freaky how people can be so removed from what is so obvious. Physical comfort is so clearly a basic need, particularly for non verbal babies!

If someone came home and their partner was on the couch crying would they say “they’re housed, they’re clean, they’re fed” and just ignore them? Even if my partner cried at home for months because something was going on, I’d be there for them every single night and surely anyone but a neglectful partner would. So why do some people expect more from babies?

I wish I could have this conversation with my SIL but even when I try softly softly she is mega judgey, stuck in her ways and mean and interprets it as a competition between our kids rather than an interesting opportunity to discuss parenthood….

 

[sweettea]

@deavallsbabe My parents apparently did this and it's one of the main reasons I will never let my own daughter CIO - it just breaks my heart when she cries. Crying is communication

 

[paigerific87]

@deavallsbabe This makes me crazy too. To say that all your needs are met because you’re not hungry or thirsty or dirty or in imminent danger (but how would a baby know that anyway) is so insane. I feel like some people decide that emotional needs only count once a kid is old enough to talk or express them but this discounts that babies are also people who experience human feelings.

 

[singbassman]

@deavallsbabe I will say though... My mental health TANKED after having my LO and there were a couple times I had to put him down and let him cry for like 5, 10 minutes so I could regroup. He was a very screamy newborn. But I don't know if that's CIO. I didn't go longer than ten minutes, actually I probably didn't even last that long...

 

[anceadcathach]

@singbassman This is not the same as CIO (like OP is sharing about). There are absolutely times when it's best to set baby down in a safe space for a few minutes so you can regulate yourself in order to take care of your baby safely!

 

[rainbu]

@singbassman Definitely not the same! I had times when little one was teething or had an ear infection where his cries pretty much gave me a panic attack. Thankfully my husband was there and I could just pass him off and regroup. Eventually we learned that those were pain cries and had infant Tylenol/motrin on hand to calm him down. Just took some trial and error.

 

[deavallsbabe]

@singbassman you did the right thing! that’s not the same as CIO at all.

 

[albinoguitman]

@singbassman 5 or 10 minutes when you need to regroup is so different from what they're doingm

 

[singbassman]

@albinoguitman Yes, true

 

[albinoguitman]

@crocodilehuricane CIO is child abuse to me. I know we aren't supposed to say it, but that's what's in my heart. Especially longer than a few minutes.

 

[zera]

@kristyrh I read this and my heart just hurt for him.

 

[jennie1980]

@zera My eyes teared up.

Every time someone describes CIO in my bump group I have to stop reading. Those poor babies deserved better. I’ll take every single sleep deprived night over my baby experiencing that even one time.

 

[erinrohman]

@jennie1980 I'm sitting here with tears streaming down my face holding my baby girl, promising to never ever do this to her. I would never. I'll take sleep deprivation too, over my poor baby feeling alone and scared.

 

[jakoblaj]

@zera I’ve read this while nursing my daughter to sleep and am crying hearing about that poor baby. I could never do that to my daughter. It breaks my heart just thinking about it.

 

[katrina2017]

@kristyrh I just get to the point with these posts where I emotionally shut myself off because they make me so sad for the little ones and I obviously can’t do anything to help. I made the mistake of torturing myself by going to r/sleeptrain after reading some comments on a CIO post, and I found post after post where parents literally described their child vomiting as just part of the process in sleep training. I remember one vile comment even saying something like, “after a night spent in their own vomit they don’t cry again” or something like that. It just blows my mind how anyone can be so callous.

Even working parents at their wits’ end should CARE about the experience their child is having, not be cavalier about a baby/toddler sleeping in their own vomit after crying themselves sick for their parents.

Your sister-in-law sounds like an idiot, frankly. Even people who are pro-CIO are aware that there should be an actual method and that hours, plural, of straight crying is too long.

 

[samkruger]

@katrina2017 Inversely, there was a post once in the moderatelygranola sub where someone was seeking recs for “crunchier” subs. Someone recommended this sub (which was crazy to me because I never really considered AP to be crunchy, just tending to my child’s basic needs), and a few of the comments talked about how this sub allegedly solidified their decision to sleep train because of how “sleep deprived and tortured” we all seemed. I find this to be the most pleasant of all the parenting groups that I’m apart of, but it was funny to see the other side’s perspective of us.

 

[peruss]

@samkruger I mean… I am definitely sleep deprived! But my child’s emotional well being and my own sense of personal responsibility/ethics is worth more to me than being well rested. I just drink my tea every morning and move on. It’s not a terribly long phase in the grand scheme of things!

I don’t understand people who have a baby and then are shocked that that means disrupted sleep. Like COME ON, what did you expect??