My Girlfriend’s 12 y/o Is Out of Control and Threatening to Kill Herself!

@waywardson I agree with almost everything you said, except for me breaking her trust. I moved in about four months ago, let my girlfriend take the lead, and would never dole out a punishment off the cuff. I let her mom do it after we’ve spoken or we do it together.

As for finding compassion, I was very compassionate when I moved in, tried to be very understanding. Then Kylie told us that Kaia told her what a sucker I was. Of course I knew every time Kaia was lying, I just didn’t show it, trying to show her that I was on her side.

And lastly, I still don’t get angry about this stuff. I try to take all of this stuff very calmly.
 
@petermushk I found your other comment about food and cleaning. I’m going address the food portion first, I don’t agree with using food as punishment or referring to it as “good” or “bad” or “permitted”. Girls especially at this age develop eating disorders, food is used to cope with stress. The only time foods should be considered “bad” is if it’s cooked horribly or a major health hazard. Denying a child food is neglect. If they are sneaking certain foods, then buy less of the junk and replace it with healthier options. Find a way to say Yes, instead of No. You can even use allowing her to buy her favorite snacks as a reward.

Now I have used cleaning as a tool for punishments, it doesn’t work and you’re going to create resentment instead of positive change. It’ll become an uphill battle. I regret ever using cleaning as a punishment. Cleaning as a punishment is a humiliation to a person and is not natural consequence of an action. This girl may need to be evaluated, I would look up oppositional defiant disorder, you can take her to the ER for a mental health evaluation. But honestly, you guys need to get a family therapist involved asap. You should consider parenting classes, they can truly be helpful.
 
@waywardson Thank you for your insight. I will definitely let their mother know so she can make more informed decisions.

My girlfriend has been asking her therapist for family sessions for quite a while. However, they have been denied because Kaia “isn’t ready.” And trust me, if we go off of her timetable, she will never be ready.
 
@petermushk You moved into their space 4 months ago and you find it appropriate to dole out a punishment? You’ve neglected to explain what these punishments are, so before I can give you honest advice. I need to know what are these punishments? Off the cuff or not; you are not in a position to be doing so at all. You are a stranger to these children and there is no trust there, so like I said, you’re a stranger whose given out a consequence when it’s not your place and any trust you could’ve started on has been broken. If calling a 12 year old child a sociopath, liar, and manipulative after 2 hospitalizations for suicidal ideation is compassion to you or your GF then I would seriously reconsider your involvement in this situation. Children do not go to those lengths unless there is a reason to. I have yet to see the children’s father mentioned in your post? What is his involvement?

But most importantly, what are these punishments?
 
@waywardson No. I said she lies, cheats, and steals all the time to get what she wants. Her mom told me she might be sociopathic. I assumed she was just using hyperbole because based on everything I’d seen, she seemed pretty normal to me. But now after moving in, I see the real Kaia.

Punishments include: an added week to internet restriction, no video games, extra chores, loss of her backpack (if she steals) for a month (and she still steals even without the backpack, it’s just not as easy for us not to notice), loss of right to go to a planned birthday or school party, or no sweets for a day or two.

These are their mom’s punishments that were pre-established. My only time that I gave out the punishment myself (after talking with my girlfriend…obviously) was when she had just gotten back from the hospital and had said that her mom was one of her biggest triggers.
 
@ckp737 Any of the above listed problems. There’s a new one everyday. But one example would be: she stole an iPad from school (plus she’s already on a previous restriction from using the internet except for homework). We caught her using it in her room. So, I said that she has to wash the walls downstairs and no unauthorized food for the weekend. And now (because of the counselor), I added a reward; she can have one hour of video games if she does the job to my satisfaction.

I showed her what to do, she did a pretty good job, she played her video games, and then I find little candy wrappers where she was sitting. I didn’t even punish her for that and she still swears up and down it wasn’t her. I had just cleaned that entire area.
 
@petermushk You seriously need to figure out the difference between punishment and natural consequences.

Holy hannnah.

I hope this is fake, because you’re coming off as callous and authoritarian.

Family therapy is good, therapy for you and your girlfriend - specifically on how to parent in this situation - would also be good.

If you are genuinely interested reading, I recommend these books:
  • how to talk so kids can listen
  • whole brain child
  • no drama discipline
  • the explosive child
  • self-reg
Compassion is needed here. And you need to check your biases.
 
@kaykay8 “Check your biases.” Good god, I hope you’re not a parent, you still haven’t even learned how to talk adults. “Compassion is needed here.” Where is your compassion?
 
@petermushk I have 3 kids, 2 of which are ND.

I meant what I said. And the bias was about the ND and how you’re treating a legitimate disability. It was to look inward and see what you’re holding as a bias, because your post is full of it.

My compassion is for your GIRLFRIENDS child, the minor and innocent in this situation. You’re an adult, and I’m trying to educate you. I hope you check out those books - they helped me with my ND kids.
 
@livingstonlakshmanan Jesus, you people are incredible…

I’m talking about sodas, candy bars, cupcakes. And even if I was talking about a sandwich, many parents would be pissed if their kid started chowing down and then wouldn’t eat dinner.
 
@petermushk You're going to give this girl an eating disorder. Food should NEVER be part of a restriction OR a reward. Ever. Food is sustenance and thats it. You eat when your body tells you that you are hungry and stop when it tells you that you are full. Period. Anything else and it stops being about food and starts being about control. Her having to hide and sneak candy is already showing her trying to have control over her situation by eating when you say she isnt allowed to. You are already seeing signs that the stepping stones towards an eating disorder are being walked.

If there are foods you dont want her eating you dont buy them. Stop allowing junk food in the home and instead buy healthy snacks and treats(of which there are MANY) that its okay for her to fill up on. But please, if you care about this girl or her mother(which it sounds like you do) stop having food be part of the situation.

As far as her behavior goes, I think what her counselor is trying to say in regards to giving her a reward at the end of her punishment. Is that punishments need to have a clear set end to them so she doesnt feel as if she is always in trouble and so she knows if she follows through with her punishment she will have all the same rights and permissions youd give to her sister once it is over.

When children feel as if they are the "bad" child they will act accordingly. Especially in a situation like the one you and your gf are in where you are a new element being added to the family and a new person taking her mothers attention away from just her and her sister. Make sure you give your gf and her kids time alone so they still feel like she is as available to them as she was before. Maybe one night a week, regardless of punishments, your gf has a special dinner with just her girls. And makes individual time for each of them as well. Its important for young girls to have that connection and to know that regardless of their behaviour they still get time to be with their mom and have her love and affection.

I've both been the bad teenage girl, and have children of my own(including an almost pre-teen daughter). And I know how it feels to have all the changes going on internally and mentally that a girl her age does. I also suspect I am neurodivergent and I have suffered from mental health and self harm behaviour as well as suicidal ideation in my teen and early adult years. And I have lost loved ones to suicide.
I cannot stress enough that even if she doesnt mean to kill herself, you have to take it seriously and give her the reaponse you would give to her if it was serious anyway. Because you and your gf will NEVER forgive yourselves or forget it if heaven forbid one time you don't take it seriously and she pushes it too far. Kids dont understand the lasting permanence of their actions at this age. You have to be the ones who understand how serious it COULD BE and act accordingly(which it sounds like you are so far).

Dont give up on her. She will know the moment you do. You wont be able to hide that from her. I know its really difficult being a parent and also coming into a situation where you are being asked by your gf to fill a parent-like role in these girls lives. I myself am married to someone who is not the biological parent to my children. And we had to work hard to figure out the right balance and timeframe for my kids as well as my husband for when he started behaving like a father figure with them. We have been married for almost 5 years and he only in the last year started doing more "parental" things like reminding about cleaning up after themselves, or doing their chores, or finishing their homework. So maybe some of the pushback you are getting from your gfs daughter on punishments is because you jumped into that role a little too quickly.

It sounds like from your post and how stressed and out of your depth you feel that maybe its too soon for you, too. Perhaps taking a step back and letting mom be the enforcer of rules and punishments and you just being there behind closed doors to support mom would be better for now? Thats for you and your gf to decide and discuss between yourselves and maybe your gfs daughters therapist. But its something to consider because you having to play step dad too fast too soon will absolutely impact your relationship inevitably, even if you dont see it happening yet.
 
@alexbright922 Thank you for your thoughtful response. I will definitely think about the food thing. It feels almost (almost) impossible to keep junk food out of these kids’ hands, but I will discuss that with their mother. As for the end to the punishment: the standard with the family is to have the internet/video games/phone privileges/etc. taken away for a week when they do something bad. The only problem is…Kaia can never make it a week before she has done something else that warrants a week of punishment/consequences. We have even tried (multiple times) just wiping the slate clean, because, to tell you the truth, we are as sick of seeing her on restriction as she is. It doesn’t help. We honestly feel like she doesn’t care, is going to do whatever she wants, and will sneak/lie/steal her way to get it. And I would totally agree with you on the parenting thing (I still mostly agree with everything you said), the only problem is that if she is telling the truth, her main trigger is her mother. So, that’s why I come in as a non-judgmental adult to tell her what happened, what are the consequences, and what is expected.

Thanks again for the time and effort you put into your response.
 
@petermushk If you wipe the slate clean so to speak, what is it she does to get into trouble? I'm having trouble understanding if she is allowed to have internet and whatever food she wants and isnt getting into trouble for avoiding/breaking her punishment. What are some of the initial behavior issues that cause you to punish her? I think understanding that will give me(and probably the other commentors) an easier time giving you more direct advice about how to handle her and what a more natural and direct consequence for her actions than what you have tried so far.

Lets say she is out of trouble and things are going good for instance. What kind of behaviour would she get in trouble for?
 
@alexbright922 Not doing her chores, not doing her homework, stealing (headphones, sweaters, pens, almost anything she feels like), lying…well, she usually isn’t punished for that, it’s just annoying when we say there will be no punishment, we just want the truth, and she still can’t do it.

She does many other “bad” things or things against her mother’s wishes, but those are the only ones that warrant a punishment.
 
@petermushk You sound exactly like the empathetic, supportive, patient, caring, loving, and understanding step parent a suicidal, neurodivergent child needs in her life. It's no wonder she's making great strides, her mental health is improving in leaps and bounds, and she's finding true joy in her life as a reason to keep fighting to exist on this planet as an alive person with such a solid foundation of unconditional love,.respect, and support as this.

Wait. She isn't? Hmm. Have you tried persistently punishing a desperate and despondent child with special needs more frequently, more harshly, and in more creative ways, while telling her you think she's nothing but a sour, lying, scheming, conniving manipulator? Sounds like you have, so I'm not really sure what else to suggest that will surely make her want to cling to life, and fight tooth and nail to survive in order to continue to live in your presence and under your authority for the next 2,190 days at a minimum. At least before she can legally and somewhat feasibly attempt to leave and live independently.

I'm sure she's super duper excited at that prospect, all while knowing she's surrounded by love and support at every trial and tribulation she faces in the next 6 years and beyond.
 
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