Ok which matters more: WWs or Total Nap Time/24 hr sleep?

[everest]

Me again haha. As I continue to try and tinker with my 7.5 month old's schedule to address the new EWT (5am and can't be rocked back down/extended in any way as of this week. He wakes up RARING to go and happy and not even all that hungry)...do I start with the experiment of longer WW before bed IF that means less total nap time in the day (AKA capping his third nap to ensure he's up with enough time to get 3-3.5 hrs before bedtime)?! For example: yesterday looked like this:

Up at 520:

Nap 1: 8:30-945

Nap 2: 12:30-1:50

Nap 3: 4:20-5

Bedtime 7pm

I didn't feel like I could START Nap 3 earlier because of necessary WW so he's sleepy but I didn't feel like I could END it earlier bc he only had 2.5 hours of naps before then (and typically gets more like 3-3.5)

Would the hack be to keep him up closer to 8pm for bedtime? So it's a 3 hour WW versus a 2? He went down like a breeze and seemed tired but then got up this am at 4:50. Or a mix of both? Nap 3 being more like 4:20-4:40...then bedtime 730 or 8?

I can't tell if EWT is a result of too much daytime sleep OR too short of bedtime WW and MY BRAIN HURTS!!! LOL

P.S. We have tried dropping nap #3 but it doesn't work when he's UP this early but it feels like he will be UP this early UNTIL he drops that last nap. Sorry for the caps I'm tired ◡̈

 

[br4nd0n]

@everest Unpopular opinion, but wake windows aren’t evidence based, so if you ask me I’d say as long as your baby is happy and sleeping as long as he/she needs to wake up and be happy again, then to hell with the wake windows. Babies aren’t robots and they don’t inherently know what “ideal or desired” wake windows should be. Follow their cues and go based on that imo.

 

[nhungthientai]

@everest 8.5 months, similar boat even with a solid 2 nap schedule (3.5/3/4). My Overton window of acceptable morning wake has just shifted to 5.30 it seems like an acceptable price to pay when I know he’s generally quite “good” and predictable with his naps, which hasn’t been the case up till now.

DWT will be 6.30 when I go back to work anyway.

 

[everest]

@nhungthientai We got 530 this AM after pushing his bedtime/pre-bed WW by 30 mins and I sorta decided the same haha i'm like well, he's happy and sleeps through the night, I think I can suevive this. 4:45am however, hurts my SOUL haha

 

[nhungthientai]

@everest Ugh I got too smug and he’s just woken up from a 30 minute nap.

 

[nhungthientai]

@everest Oh yes 04- is not a time that should be witnessed!

 

[unchosen]

@everest I’d try a longer wake window before bed. Over a week or so, this might also help push DWT back to a more “reasonable time”. Also what time does baby have milk/bottle when they wake up?

 

[everest]

@unchosen Usually within 10 mins of waking up (AFTER I’ve tried rocking/extending unsuccessfully lol) so like yesterday it was 5:30a

 

[unchosen]

@everest If you can I’d try doing anything else but feeding if it isn’t time (e.g rocking and patting - even if it takes ages, offering a small bit of water, leaving them to it). I say this because the feeding can reinforce that that’s the time to wake up. It’s hard, but babies can respond quickly to this. Pairing this with a longer wake window can really help reinforce it’s not quite time to get up.

For later sleep and feed you could try pushing back by 5-10 mins every few days until you are where you want to be for a gradual approach.

 

[everest]

@unchosen I see, I see! Even if he hasn’t eaten in, like, 11-12 hours by then?

 

[unchosen]

@everest Hopefully the small change in time by 5-10 mins later every few days for bed, will push wake up on the other side by the same amount. So eventually you’ll hit your desired wake and sleep time, then can reinforce that with a feed. So essentially they’re sleeping for the same amount of time they always have, but the bed and wake up time shifts to suit your pattern.

 

[everest]

@unchosen That makes sense—i've always heard, though, that later bedtime doesnt always = later wake up?? but hopefully once we push the WW longer and if bedtime ends up in his age sweet spot (between 7-8), he will sleep those same 10.5-11 hours and end up in the more doable DWT. Also, lol, by then he will prob have dropped the 3rd nap and this may fix itself. Thanks so much for your help and input!

 

[unchosen]

@everest That is very true! You can do all the things but baby is gonna baby. I’m sure you are doing great. Best of luck.

 

[katrina2017]

@everest My baby is 7.5 months old too. We dropped the third nap and extended his last ww before bed. Now he wakes up at 8am. Before we did this he was awake at 630 ready to go. I

 

[babyfaith]

@katrina2017 Interesting, keep wondering if we need to drop a nap. My baby is 8 months old in 3 days but still 3 naps. The couple of times she’s had 2 naps recently because we couldn’t fit a 3rd nap in for a decent bedtime, she was up and down constantly for hours after going to bed but I think maybe she was overtired. Idk so stressed about sleep. She’s been waking up at 6am or earlier everyday for the last week or so and won’t go back to sleep. She napped for 1hr20 this morning but then she just napped for 20 minutes and it’s 1pm.. so she definitely isn’t making it to bed on 2 naps.

 

[katrina2017]

@babyfaith It was a rough couple of days when we were transitioning but he fully refused the third nap. And by the time he would take it, it would result in a 10pm bedtime. I went through the hard days with an extremely long wake window but eventually he adjusted and both naps were great. Hang in there

 

[babyfaith]

@katrina2017 Sounds so tough but it’s great that he’s sleeping til 8am now. How long were your extremely long wake windows?

 

[katrina2017]

@babyfaith About 5 hours on the really hard days. He would wake up around 2pm from the last nap and I would aim to get him in bed at 7

 

[everest]

@katrina2017 This is fantastic! I just can’t drop the third nap yet when his second ends at, like 1-2p!!

 

[seekinganswersinlife]

@everest I feel like I have a similar debate frequently, as do (I would assume) other daycare parents. My 7.5 month old naps ~2 hours total at daycare (approx 915-945, 115-245), then takes a 10 min catnap in the car on the way home at 5. So should she go to bed early as hell (6-630pm) because she was super stimulated and barely sleeping? Or does she have a normal 4 hour wake window/7pm bedtime because she woke up around 3 AND snoozed on the way home.

A month ago it was easily early bedtime, but as she's grown into a 2 nap schedule at home I'm moving towards maintaining the wake window on school days. Babies can thrive on less sleep than we think. Ive been putting her down at 630pm and she was waking up at 445/5am. Last night I put her down at 705pm and she slept until 610am. I think @tuned4him first two paragraphs are spot on.